Many of you have commented my post from yesterday concerning John Hantz's idea to turn Detroit into an urban farming city. I am very happy about the discussion thus far, because while many people have responded positively to this idea, a handful of people have expressed doubts or concerns about Detroit evolving into an urban farm. I whole-heartedly agree with those who have stated that Detroit has a more to offer than farm land. The major hitch is what to do with all of those vacated lots. A city spread out is not in my opinion a unified city. There are huge swaths of the city that are what experts refer to as food "deserts". A food desert is a region in which there is no adequate access to fresh food. This has become a common problem in cities that are experience depopulation, and keeping people spread out will not help solve the problem. In a neighborhood with twenty families a small grocery store could keep in business, but when all but four families move out, it is not economically feasible to stay in business. These are simply factors of supply and demand. With out demand from a sizable population Detroit simply cannot supply those that remain with the current conventional food supply chains in place.
Urban Farming can help support areas in current food deserts and while Detroit has not transformed itself into the giant urban farm of Hantz's dreams, it has created a well established network of community urban gardening initiatives. Earthworks is one such farm that was established to provide for a food bank. Most of the food that food banks receives comes from either donations or the USDA commodity surplus system, both of which are heavy on the processed foods and very light on fresh healthy produce. In an article in Metro Times, Larry Gabriel outlines why urban farms are important for revitalizing and supporting Detroit.
He's motivated to feed people, but he also talks about using the work to empower people. "They can see that we're not just victims," says Yakini. "People will see that we can grow food and we're not dependent on others." ... There are skills to be learned, such as composting and cultivation, marketing and sales, even processing the food into products such as tomato sauce, pickles, jams and jellies. City government needs to create policies that encourage and support urban farming. (The city could legalize beekeeping, for instance.) And it wouldn't hurt if federal subsidies to giant agribusiness either stopped or were more equitably dispersed to smaller farmers. In Cuba, the government got behind the issue and supported training and even land reforms that helped small cooperative farms flourish.
http://www.metrotimes.com/news/story.asp?id=13732
As you can see urban farms are not just about trying to make a profit off of abandoned land, but lay deeply rooted in an commitment to building community and helping those in need help themselves and become independent from government and other organizational outreach. And as for the government subsidies that support large farms...well we'll get to that tomorrow.
If you are interested more about Earthworks Farm here is a link to a video about the farm
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0JvUQxsU8jc
Here's a question for all of you. What do you know about gardening? About the farm subsidies our taxes pay?
Like I said yesterday, I think that turning Detroit into a farming site is not a bad idea. I don’t know much about farming and such but I sure can learn. Many people don’t know how to work a garden and especially one that will produce food but I bet many are willing to learn with this crisis that we are going through right now. Since the project is just starting, they could use the land that is vacant to experiment and depending on the results they could continue with the plan. For the most part this project seems to be that it will bring many benefits to local residents and will help the rest of us become more independent on other states/countries. E.A
ReplyDeleteHannah, you wrote that:
ReplyDelete"As you can see urban farms are not just about trying to make a profit off of abandoned land, but lay deeply rooted in an commitment to building community and helping those in need help themselves and become independent from government and other organizational outreach."
I appreciate the idea of an urban farm being an innovative way to build prosperity and community in Detroit, but commentors keep overlooking the idea that Detroit is HOME for many people. It's not a platform for a social experiment, it's a place where people live and work. Imagine if Ann Arbor or Grand Rapids had been through the worst imaginable economic times and then an outside group came in and said, "Listen, I know you've all been trained in other jobs and have a lifetime of experience in them , have built your lives, families and identities around them, but now you're all going to be farmers." People would be upset and there would probably be a huge divide in the community over the idea. From my understanding, most of the people in Detroit have had a hard enough time with the economic crisis already. While it's important that people out of work with few job options find a career they are passionate about, I doubt urban farming would be at the top of most peoples' lists. Wouldn't it be better to use government money to send the recently laid off back to school so they can become qualified to pursue the career they desire instead of deciding how their time should be allocated for them?
I totally agree that people in Detroit need better access to fresh fruits and vegetables, but why does it have to be through such an obscure way? If most suburbanites want fresh food, their first instinct isn't to go plant seeds, it's to go to the grocery store. Eastern Market is a phenomenal farmer's market in the Detroit area with great prices and great fresh foods. Why don't we encourage the government to give the people who contribute to this market incentives to expand their business and open up another marketplace instead of deciding that Detroit is so hopeless it needs huge plots of farm land to to access the same resources that people from other cities take for granted?
What saddens me about the comments on the last blog entry on this topic is that people have ceased to see Detroit as a place where people live. Many of us are from areas surrounding Detroit but even we are blinded by news coverage saying that Detroit isn't worth fighting for any more. This city is not just a statistic. Even though I live right outside the city, my home town is a different world. I still see Detroiters as individual people like me, not potential members of a social experiment.
After reading the comment above me, I have to disagree. I think the farming idea could be a great opportunity for Detroit. I'm from the Detroit area too and I don't quite understand the argument that you make about us forgeting that people "live" in Detroit, Bridgett. I mean, of course people live there, but I doubt many of the residents of Detroit would say that they're satisfied with their current sate of affairs. Michigan has the highest unemployment rate in the country, stemming from the city of Detroit. Plus, it's not like turning to farming would kick anyone out of the city, it would just bring new opportunities to turn things around. Lets face it, the auto industry will never be what it once was in Detroit. The city's population continues to decrease year after year. It has been plagued with scandals and governmental corruption. It literally doesn't have much else left to lose. So I would hardly classify the farming idea as a "social experiment" but instead look at it as a wave of new opportunities. I guess I'm confused because I don't know what you would suggest instead. Should we just leave Detroit how it is because people "live" there and we shouldn't bring about change? Because if we do that, we'll never make any progress.
ReplyDeleteI agree with Alex that Detroit would benefit from starting a new type of job market. The auto industry won't be like it has in the past so why not try something new? Yes, people live there but mostly because they can't afford to leave. Everyone tries to get out of the city because of the high murder and crime rates. Change is necessary since the current way the city is operating clearly isn't working. So again I say to try urban farming and see what happens. People will have greater opportunities and a whole new job market will do wonders for the area. A, E
ReplyDeleteBridgett, I really appreciate your comment. It is very well stated.
ReplyDeleteWhile I realize that urban farming has the potential to rebuild and restore Detroits economy as well as bring food to areas with people who need it, I still think that it's a bad idea. Ajminch you say that "It(Detroit) has literally nothing to lose," but I think it does. I think it will lose its identity. Yes the city has been through the biggest economic downturn ever but I think we're forgetting like Bridget said that people live there. Detroit is my home and while I know that the recession has affected my community and family I do believe that we have more skills and abilities than becoming farmers. We have more to offer society and the world.
Honestly,I believe that Detroiters will be willing to work through the economic crisis. And while I don't have some bright idea on how to restore the city I do think that we should offer more to the people of Detroit.
Nick you say that "people live there mostly because they can't afford to leave" but I bet that people are still there because they feel connected to the city even in these tough times. Detroiters take pride in where they come from just like everyone else does. So for someone to come in and turn it into a farm will probably not go over to well. The people of Detroit are not hopeless and will get through this recession some way and somehow without becoming a huge patch of farm land.
I wonder how the people of Detroit feel about urban farming, then you might be able to persuade me...
Like I said yesterday, although I think this is a good idea, I don't think it is a single answer for Detroit. Honestly I feel that with current conditions and money from the government that Detroit should try to manufacture windmills and trains and other things as well. It is a city set up for manufacturing, and as for crime rates I feel that if the thirty percent unemployed had jobs that crime would go down considerably. So in the meantime it may be a good idea, but in the long run I thing Detroit should try to still manufacture things other than cars. If Michigan started to build hydroelectric dams along the coast, the only true no waste dams and plants, Michigan could sell its energy surplus to other states, especially when the car market is looking further into electric plug in technology.
ReplyDeleteI argue that Detroit has a lot to lose, such as these titles:
ReplyDelete- #1 most dangerous city in America
- #2 highest unemployment rate in America
- One of the most polluted cities in America
- Corrupt city government
- A school board that "misplaces" millions of dollars from its budget
Forbes made a ranking of the "most miserable" cities in America, and Detroit ranked first. So yeah, Detroit has a lot to lose: it can lose its multitude of problems.
While I still think that urban farming is a good idea to try in Detroit, I am intrigued by the argument that such a thing would hurt the culture of the city. I think that urban farming would change the culture of the city of Detroit, but would do so in a positive way. Urban farming could give an opportunity for people to once again view Detroit as a productive city, rather than an economically destitute one.
ReplyDeleteYesterday Sean posted something that I think we should all still consider: "farming has a very low worker-per-acre ratio."
ReplyDeleteI admit that I am nothing near an expert on the economic situation of Detroit, so correct me if I'm wrong when I say one of the biggest problems Detroit has is unemployment.
While I'm not sure what the solution would be, I don't think turning Detroit into a farm city will fix the biggest issues at hand.
I'm rather surprised at the resistance to the idea. I also must admit that I don't entirely understand the argument Bridgitt and LaShawn are making. Yes, people live in Detroit. All too many denizens are unemployed and no small number could stand to benefit from urban farming. In the last thread I voiced my concern that farming jobs would offer hardly the same pay or number as manufacturing, but anything is better than nothing. This is especially true when investors are unwilling and unlikely to bring in new factories to the city. The government really should do more to encourage this, but that's not going to happen anytime soon. Also good would be the government helping retrain unemployed laborers or just educate in general, but this is not going to happen to a significant extent. It would also be great if a federal agency rooted out the apparently pervasive corruption, but if it hasn't happened yet, it won't any time soon.
ReplyDeletePeople live in Detroit. But less than before. The previous urban farming article states that the investor is purchasing vacant or abandoned land, not uprooting anyone. If the concept takes off, it could run into some trouble in that regard, but time will tell.
But now for another concern I have. Hannah, you seem to be pushing for community-centered farming, something which the previous article did not seem to be about, if I read it correctly. It will be very hard to change mindsets and reignite community where it has been lost. I approve of the attempt, but have my doubts.
To your questions at the end of your post: I have no experience with farming, on large or small scale; however, I would really like to learn. Persuading a significant portion of the population to have their own small plots, or even a large community plot, could greatly improve our lives from a number of standpoints.
Also, the aid to large corporate food/seed producers is absolutely ludicrous. I imagine a lot of people don't know much on the topic. As you brought it up, I assume you have a degree of knowledge on the subject, and hope you bring it up in a later post. If not, I'll probably make it one of mine for next week.
I also agree that farming will not open up as many jobs some people might hope for. Farming is still about making a profit and the more unnecessary jobs assignment, the less profit there is to make. A man on a tractor could do the work of 20 men in a field in less than an hour. The city will be able to make some money off of the land that they farm though, but I think the community, as a whole will not see a drastic change in the unemployment rate. (A)
ReplyDeletehey, ya'll, just so happens i work at earthworks - and live in the city and - was interviewed by the folks at fortune magazine for this article posted the other day about john hantz - and happen to blog about urban farming in detroit. which means i feel like a have couple of cents to throw in on this.
ReplyDeletei've written enough on this topic that i don't really want to say too much here other than direct you to read some of those writings here
http://www.metromodemedia.com/blogs/bloggers/patrickcrouch0143.aspx
you might also like to see the blog post i did about this - which includes hantz farm president mike score's comments about my post here
http://littlehouseontheurbanprairie.wordpress.com/2010/01/04/magazine-article-and-the-bus/
i'd also invite you to check out earthworks website
www.earthworksdetroit.org
anyone know how to put hyperlinks in a comment? sure would have made this easier.
Starting any kind of new industry in Detroit can only be a good thing, because right now Detroit's economy is in ruins and people are leaving the area rapidly. Starting these urban farming programs could provide some much needed jobs in the area and, who knows, maybe if the idea works out well enough Detroit's economy may start improving. Although I don't think that this idea of urban agriculture can replace the auto industry that Detroit lost hopefully it can start to revive the area or at least work to halt the current down turn. Anything is worth a shot to try and revitalize what was once a successful major city in our nation.
ReplyDeleteI know this has worked in Milwaukee really well because of (Will ALlen? I think his name is). People have said that creating farms in Detroit is only part of the solution and I agree, but it would be a great way to help provide the most basic resource--food--which will make it easier to address other problems. Also, food and farming create a real sense of community that would also impact crime rate and general neighborhood safety. I say woohoo farming!
ReplyDeleteA, E
Turning some of Detroit into farming land won't make everyone farmers. Not every job in the market of farming land is actual ground work. There needs to be people managing finances and transportation and organization. Researchers and landscapers are necessary to ensure efficient production of food and how to make the most use from the land. When building a new company, or even renovating a city, it is necessary to have a variety of jobs. (T)
ReplyDeleteWhile farms would not really help to concentrate or increase the population of Detroit, it would help the population that is already there. I think that the whole farming idea could be helpful, but that it is not a magic bullet that will fix all of Detroit's problems.
ReplyDeleteA
I can see where some of the opposition would come in, I mean it isn't as if we're talking about a random piece of land that is unpopulated. There are people living there who may not want to move simply because the government wants to make Detroit an urban farm setting.
ReplyDeleteHowever, I can also understand why people would supported this idea whole heartedly. It seems (at least on paper) that this plan, or one very similar, would really benefit Detroit as a whole.
Regardless of what someone's point of view is on this particular matter I think that we can all agree that whether we like it or not Detroit has to find another industry to invest in if it has any hope of overcoming this recession anytime soon.
I think I just read this new somewhere 2 days ago, and really concerned about this situation about the urban farm...I agree with what Ali said, the urban area, people might live there for a long time and don't want to move, because of the high expense to move to the other place and also, I know it will really help Detroit if the government doing the urban farm things, seems very useful, but not that easy in some way.
ReplyDelete